Dad of LightFollow

So has anyone watched this on Netflix yet? Watched it with my wife and son. Kind of silly, but fun. Feels a little like an infomercial for FFXIV. My wife actually wanted to log in and play after watching it.

Exceptionally cheesy, occasionally feelsy, but also made me shake my fist at the screen a few times thinking, "THAT'S NOT HOW MMOS WORK!" But yes, I'd very much call it the world's longest commercial for a video game.

Really? I mean, I get that in a series where the game is made up (.hack, SoA, Log Horizon, etc have all made me say that at times) but you'd think it'd be a bit more realistic in a series based on a real game.

Ummm Id say .hack (Sign not Roots) was a very accurate portrayal on an MMO, and Log Horizon came kinda close too.

Now yeah SoA is NOTHING like an MMO

I don't remember too many episodes where players insist the game is broken because other players won't do the quests for them.

I mean it behaved like an MMO period behves not talkin full dive her.

Log Horizon and .hack//sign characters behaved 100% like MMO ones, it show cased trolling, showed that there are political aspects to an mmo community, showed that it was not always grinding/leveling and sometimes it was just simple social gathering (finely displayed by .hacks most talking than anything else), and still showed grinding, raiding, dungeon running.

Whereas SAO... if you never told anyone that anime was supposed to exist in an MMO.. theyd have no idea it wanst just some random shonen anime with zero mmo ties. I mean you rarely see stats or health bars, theres little to no indication its an MMO after the first few episodes, and dont get me started on how UN mmo like the combat system is, if MMOs played ANYTHING like SOA, point me in their direction cause I need to be playing THOSE NOW!!

Yeah, that's what bothered me about .hack...

You can't log out? Why not, exactly?

It never portrayed the players as being connected to the computer via wires or something and for some weird reason the players go go comatose and their characters are still logged into the game world? Wut? Just flick the switch on the PC/Console, seriously.

I could understand it, if maybe they were in these stasis chambers and their brains were physically wired to the machines or something, but yeah. That anime never made sense to me.

I thought the discussion was about whether or not .hack anime world/game/characters behaved like a real mmo. Not whether or not the technology they used to play said games were portrayed realistically

It's been forever since I watched the first .hack series, but my personal recollection was that it didn't really do the concept of "This is a game!" much justice, either. Yes, we had Tsukasa "stuck" and all the oddities related to Aura and the World, but if we're being honest, you could probably revise Tsukasa's character to simply being some kind of amnesiac mage and you wouldn't see a whole lot of difference in the plot outside of occasional IRL references with Bear, Rose, and such.

SAO suffers somewhat similarly, but I'd also say they tried to be a bit more MMO about it. Yes, the full-dive tech allows for more feasibility in getting stuck, but it also enables a higher degree of awareness and control. As established early on between Klein and Kirito, using skills wasn't so much a matter of pushing the right buttons as it was merely thinking about using them with the appropriate conditions met like range or MP. SAO skill development also didn't seem so rigidly class-locked, as demonstrated by how Kirito went about learning dual-wield or countering the lower leveled PKers with significant regen. You also had craft skills that leveled up similarly to how we might know here with XIV or XI. Basically, the game liked to reward dedicated use of abilities or combinations thereof. And while their hand wavey menu management might not have seemed like the most detailed means of window browsing, I'm more inclined to say that was intentionally kept minimal for entertainment value purposes.

As for Log Horizon, I'll agree it tried the most to be MMO-like, but I'd almost say there was a conceptual equivalent of the uncanny valley that went on. The raids rarely felt like anything I'd personally experienced when gaming, and I don't think that's just a JP vs. NA thing. Meanwhile, they went to great lengths to try and convey a realistic economy and/or the politics behind such, but too many MMOs nowadays more or less treat crafting as an afterthought with the best gear coming from raids/tokens. Things like RMT or people maliciously manipulating markets don't really come off as a severe problem for the not-poor, which Shiro and his immediate circle of friends obviously were not starting as high level raiders. Watching the lowbie group also felt particularly painful at times, but also became an unfortunate requirement to the series precisely because of Shiro's starting status. On the other hand, I don't think it's fair for me to be passing a final judgment on this because it's a show that seems indefinitely incomplete.

Either way, saying this genre rarely feels like it gets it right has an incredibly highly diverse list of characteristics behind the sentiment. You've got the woes of the newbie in figuring out the basics. You've then got the mid-game building upon those with ideally increasing challenges, often requiring interactions with others. PK aside, you've got things like job/gear snobbery, disagreement on tactics, those of varying skill levels/receptivity, ninja lotting, carrying their weight or seriousness in play, actually finding people with matching agendas when you want to do something, sensible expectations of play time, and then some. Endgame just tends to take all that and dials it up to 11, where grinds are stupid like XI's RMEs or worthwhile solo content pretty much ceases to exist because raider feefees. Relative to the DoL show, a lot of this was either skimmed or was never really a factor at all.

Essentially, you rarely get the vibe players are individually selfish, and not to be mean, but to prioritize personal progress. They're either happily helpful or want to kill you (in the game and real life!). There's not a whole lot of in-between that goes on. Early/mid-SAO Kirito is probably how I'd best associate myself with characters in the genre as when there is a game I latch onto, I tend to accrue as much knowledge and power as I can on my own. The identity of coming off as "godly" may not seem as prevalent in reality nowadays or like early NA launch XI, but there are still people who may come to appreciate that should I chance upon helping them out (and level caps aren't a thing--boo hiss).

I would think that one of the reasons why it wouldn't work as a real MMO is because... I don't know... half of the in-universe lore exists outside of the game and that would be kinda hard to do unless we did some sort of Assassin's Creed or Saints Row 4 style game-in-a-game type setup where we walk around outside of the game.

Hmmmm...

You know, that Could actually work if done right. But eh. That'd be some risky ground.

But there would need to be more than just Diablo-style killing and looting in the actual game itself.

Edited, Sep 12th 2017 9:43pm by Lyrailis

I was not talking about the Twilight Bracelet or any of the other silly stuff. I was talking about the premise of people who are "unable to log out" who are knocked unconscious and in a coma, taken to a hospital, but are yet still "logged into" a game. It's like "lol?". The premise behind the entire anime makes no sense.

Unless the original .hack series had nothing to do with that (the PS2 keeps this premise, that The World is some kind of magical game that can pull your literal brain/mind/soul/whatever into it and not let you leave it), I don't think seeing the first anime would change it. You still got an anime about an MMO that can somehow affect real-life, like, putting people in comas and not allowing people to log out just because they got hit by some kind of hacked/bugged/glitched enemy or something.

Again this has nothing to do with that Twilight Bracelet thing.



I've seen pictures of PSO, and uh? It looked to be far more interesting and complex than the PS2 .hack game? And besides, are you forgetting about Final Fantasy XI? Was that not a Playstation2 debut? The game was made FOR PS2 first, and the PC version came later, right?

Ohhh so what youre saying is you cant wrap your head around the fact that fiction DOESNT MAKE SENSE?!?! lol. I mean I can find **** like that wrong with EVERY anime, video game, tv show and book Ive read, seen played or watched. But I read/play/watch and do these things for ENTERTAINMENT, not to be taken seriously, thats why its called FICTION, sounds like you should stick to non fiction.


Also not once did they ever show an unconscious player in a hospital in .hack the one time they DID show the real world the unconscious player was still in their house, in their chair with the vr headset on and controller in their hand (though not actively pressing buttons) with drool sliding down the aside of their mouth.

SO they were still hocked up to the game, now if they ha been completely unplugged and in the hospital but somehow still in the game then you may have a point. of course then youd have to ask if thats the case how did they not die from eating or drinking for however long they were in said coma, to which Id again bring up.... fiction... not supposed to be realistic, and maybe they were not in comas long enough to die from dehydration or hunger, using SAO as an example it was explained that trying to forcibly log someone out by unplugging them would kill them instantly as the headset is linked to their brain, and when Kirito finally did get out and they showed him in the hospital, he was skinny and thin as hell thus showing that the effects of not eating/drinking for however long he was out definitely happened, hell he could barely walk, i believe he was in a wheelchair even.

Also like the other guy said FFXI came after .hack, obviously skills with teh console and stuff got better over time. I mean heck just look at FF7 and FF8, same console, MUCH better graphics

Well I can agree with DBZ, as an adult I can see ppl only watched that for the fights and action... you know flashing lights and explosions.. the kinda stuff that would entertain a 12 year old not an adult seeking a rich (or even decent) story. SO DBZ isnt BAD but it wouldnt be on the list of anime Id recommend to others to watch.

As for person being in a coma for multiple IRL days, ummm unless it was 7+ days yeah thats no long enough to die from it so that explains why there was no death, as for people not checking on them. You DO know thats 100% possible right? I mean outside of work if I stayed at home 7 days straight and broke off all contact with anyone not a single person would come check on me, and Id know as when I was unemployed I did just that and not a single person did. SO yes thats ENTIRELY possible. Even I thought "Really? I could be in here dead right now and not a single person has bothered to come and find out" (as I didnt live alone at the time so all someone had to do was knock on the bedroom door and or come in and see, but nope didnt happen once, instead what I did hear was a certain person talking crap about me on the phone about how I havent left the room in days (it would be different if they actually SAW or HEARD me at some point thus knowing not to check on me but I purposely waiting til no one was around to eat and or use the bathroom and I stayed quiet thus giving no one ANY reason to think I was in there and OK). So yes just because that how things would happen in YOUR wold doesnt mean it holds true for EVERYBODY.

As for lawsuits and whatnot. Thats also an easy one. The whole coma incident only happened once. when .Hack//Gu came around it was a different premise and even if it wasnt it wasnt widespread like the first games, in GU it only effected 1 person so I could see why noting happened over that, for all intent and purposes the 2nd time never happened as it could easily have been covered up since it only effected 1 person and not hundreds like the first time. In SAOs case it too only happened once, during the second season all the issues to make it so that that didnt occur was fixed, when it did "start happening again" without going into detail and spoiling things Ill just say it "wasnt really happening"


So yeah if it were happening everytime then Id be right there with you,.. like umm why havent these guys been shut down yet lol. Id still watch it though because gasp its entertaining.

I mean lets talk about horror movies, why are the cops so incompetent and or dont show up until youve already nearly died getting the job done yourself and now theyre no longer needed anyway? Why do you shot something in the head, it keeps coming at you and your first thought is to continue shooting it? How about superheroes? Why do you shoot Superman, that doesnt work then you run up on him and throw a punch? Ummm if a bullet didnt work wtf makes you think your FIST is going to? I mean I could do this ALL day. But again thats not the point of watching a movie