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Come back! Need discussion...2020 PresidentialFollow

#1 Mar 07 2019 at 10:11 AM Rating: Good
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Ahoy crazies.

I simply can't forget my password for this site. Like my very first phone number I still remember.

Here's the thing; there are gobs of dems already declaring their intent to run for prez. I'm already being torn between two great ladies. Need discussion.

My tops right now..

I <3 Liz Warren - like me, she doesn't know when to shut up. She's wicked smaht, tough as nails, but the 'R's despise her almost as much as Hilary.

Amy Klobuchar - She's mouthy too, but more moderately so. She seems to be respected on both sides of the aisle. Is the revelation that she's a 'tough' boss a factor? Her dad was one of the few columnists I read as a youngster growing up in mpls - I'm afraid I can't be neutral

It's a duel between who can best beat the current pres and who can best lead the country and our dysfunctional congress.





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#2 Mar 07 2019 at 6:46 PM Rating: Good
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Think on it. Smiley: nod
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#3 Mar 07 2019 at 9:16 PM Rating: Decent
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As much as I want to like Kamala Harris, I'm leaning toward Amy Klobuchar as of now because she is moderate. However, I have not done any research in their platform. If the DNC doesn't stop chasing shiny objects and get an identity, they will lose again.
#4 Mar 08 2019 at 8:23 AM Rating: Good
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President Hickenlooper sounds awesome, but who is this guy?
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#5 Mar 10 2019 at 1:38 AM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
f the DNC doesn't stop chasing shiny objects and get an identity, they will lose again.
Losing the identity politics could help too.
#6 Mar 10 2019 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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And let the GOP have that demographic all to themselves? Preposterous!
#7 Mar 10 2019 at 7:14 PM Rating: Decent
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The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
f the DNC doesn't stop chasing shiny objects and get an identity, they will lose again.
Losing the identity politics could help too.


Everyone plays identity politics.
#8 Mar 11 2019 at 8:43 AM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
f the DNC doesn't stop chasing shiny objects and get an identity, they will lose again.
Losing the identity politics could help too.


Everyone plays identity politics.
Need an ID to vote. ;)

I kind of liked the identity the Dems had been taking on, but brown women in hijabs might be too much even for the 'tolerant' dems.

Officially in: Former Gov. John Hickenlooper, Gov. Jay Inslee, Sen. Bernie Sanders, Sen. Amy Klobuchar, Sen. Elizabeth Warren, Sen. Cory Booker, Sen. Kamala Harris, ex-San Antonio Mayor Julian Castro, Rep. Tulsi Gabbard, former Rep. John Delaney, author Marianne Williamson and former tech executive Andrew Yang.

Formed exploratory committee: Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand; South Bend, Ind., Mayor Pete Buttigieg.
(Thanks to Chicago Tribune)

I keep seeing Biden listed as 'top' pick in many opinion polls - but he's not even running. Also there's the Starbucks guy that claims to be running independently - or maybe he's starting a third party - he seems out of touch. Maybe he needs to drink some Folgers.

Anyone watching American Gods? Season 2 started last night - it's pretty good for literature turned tv. The Laura - Mad Sweeney relationship is way different - and better, than what my imagination had lent to it when it originally read the book (although it's been a few years). Gaiman should make a cameo appearance.

Congrats Drift - good luck on fatherhood Smiley: yippee . I'd suggest skipping over parenting and going straight into grand-parenting - it's lots more fun.

Edited, Mar 11th 2019 3:43pm by Elinda
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#9 Mar 11 2019 at 12:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks. Tomorrow is the big day. I've never been so simultaneously excited and terrified.

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#10 Mar 11 2019 at 10:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Elinda wrote:
The Laura - Mad Sweeney relationship is way different - and better, than what my imagination had lent to it when it originally read the book (although it's been a few years).

I didn't think they even had one in the book
Sweeney commits suicide in Cairo early on in the book and I don't think he ever met Laura. He finds Shadow, asks for his coin back, Shadow says it's gone and Sweeney is dead a day later.
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#11 Mar 12 2019 at 7:45 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Elinda wrote:
The Laura - Mad Sweeney relationship is way different - and better, than what my imagination had lent to it when it originally read the book (although it's been a few years).

I didn't think they even had one in the book
Well that would explain it. It's such a great partnership in the show, it seems it would have stood out more in the story. I had planned to reread the book before this season, but .....SO much to read!

The rumblings I'm getting from many of the pundits that I allow access into my brain are implying that the only two with a chance to win president in 2020 are Biden and Bernie. While a Bernie-Biden battle going into the primary finals would be a fun battle to watch, I don't think either are the person we need sitting in the white house. I need to find some new voices....

Latest on Hickenlooper. He reminds me of what you might get if you got Mr. Rogers drunk enough to loosen his tongue and forget his niceties.

What is known about Jay Inslee, current gov of Washington?
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#12 Mar 12 2019 at 7:46 AM Rating: Good
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Driftwood wrote:
Thanks. Tomorrow is the big day. I've never been so simultaneously excited and terrified.


Name and pic?
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#13 Mar 12 2019 at 8:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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Elinda wrote:
What is known about Jay Inslee, current gov of Washington?

As far as I know, his primary platform is climate change which isn't going to be enough to carry him far. Maybe it should be, but it ain't.

I've zero interest in Sanders. I like Biden but wish he had run last cycle. I guess my only concern really is his age but he seems hale to me. Interested in Hickenlooper, Klobuchar, Booker, Harris. Maybe Gillebrand if she runs. Warren does nothing much for me. Really I'm just in wait-and-see and data collection mode right now though.
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#14 Mar 12 2019 at 9:45 AM Rating: Good
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What Joph said.
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#15 Mar 14 2019 at 6:57 AM Rating: Good
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Well Beto is in. Biden is still not, but media makes it sound as if it's inevitable.

I'm skeptical about Beto O'Rourke. He talks the talk, but has, as far as I can tell, skirted the 'walk'.

Right now, I'm putting Amy on top of my list. There's time....

How about that brexit?! Smiley: eek

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#16 Mar 17 2019 at 1:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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Elinda wrote:
Well Beto is in. Biden is still not, but media makes it sound as if it's inevitable.

I'm skeptical about Beto O'Rourke. He talks the talk, but has, as far as I can tell, skirted the 'walk'.
His campaign website had a page about merch, but not one talking about his policy positions last I checked. Which amused me, as it allowed someone to make the joke: "I came to Beto's site to learn about his campaign but all I got was this lousy t-shirt."
#17 Mar 18 2019 at 10:23 AM Rating: Good
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I'm tired of Beto Bernie and Biden already.

Biden made the 'slip' of tongue, which seemed to me to be a properly planned slip, about running. So, I think it's pretty safe to add him to the list of candidates. I suspect he'll have the backing of the DNC and since the last election and the revelation that the DNC are just another elite body deciding who gets to play, they'll be more careful this time around.
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#18 Mar 19 2019 at 3:17 AM Rating: Decent
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Gabbard, Warren, and Sanders are the only possible choices here-now that would upset the military-industrial-banking-1%-complex that Obama and Bush and Hillary Clinton wanted to continue.

But sure, I guess it must be difficult for a pampered person who doesn't have to be faced with 10,000 corpse-faces of children destroyed by her/his/its voted in rep, to decide.

"Who should be my President, gee gosh? The one who next destroys Syria and Iran and North Korea but gives my young American child a boon? Or gee gosh, maybe the other who next destroys Syria and Iran but Venezuela instead of North Korea (CHOICES!) but my child can get a bit more of a boon?"

GEE GOSH.

"How would we pay for a Green New Deal??"

The same way we pay for the Democrats', including your "OH GOSH, BETO OR ANOTHER ******** WHAT SHALL I DO" favorite...pay for unending war. In 1998 the Congress or something insisted that the military would be subject to an audit and kept deferring and such and in 2019 auditors and accountants were "It's literally impossible to try to find where 20 TRILLION DOLLARS went".

Which, it didn't "went", according to Modern Monetary Theory. And nor for a new Green Deal.

"Money" is a high-falutin' representation of a value placed on 7 billion humans doing work, and whatever resources they're doing it with. Those are the limits. Labor and resources.


But sorry for that aside. Elinda, I mean from this thread you'd be very happy with Beto or Biden or Harris or Booker. Someone who wouldn't upset your dainty nature upon your southern estate so much.
#19 Mar 19 2019 at 3:36 AM Rating: Decent
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While a Bernie-Biden battle going into the primary finals would be a fun battle to watch, I don't think either are the person we need sitting in the white house. I need to find some new voices....


Jesus Christ here. How less daft can a human be, compared to you?

Do you even value any policies whatsoever of any candidate? LOL I mean I replied a previous reply wondering but hadn't yet acknowledged such an utter lack of morality. Totally amoral reasons for voting for the most powerful human in the world, who could easily kill millions of others.

"voices" what in the fuck does that mean? Better liars about Medicare for all? Your brain is cottage cheese and I despise the brain such as you have. You're Lori Loughlin's USC bitch child. Nothing more.

Edited, Mar 19th 2019 4:38am by Palpitus1
#20 Mar 19 2019 at 3:57 AM Rating: Good
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Palpitus1 wrote:
"voices" what in the fuck does that mean? Better liars about Medicare for all? Your brain is cottage cheese and I despise the brain such as you have. You're Lori Loughlin's USC bitch child. Nothing more.

Edited, Mar 19th 2019 4:38am by Palpitus1
Well your voice wasn't really the guidance I was looking for.

The issues I'm watching: Healthcare (for all). Medicare for all is the best plan I've seen on the drawing board. Until hc is fixed stuff like mental health, opiate abuse, etc etc, is still all in the hands of big insurance and big pharma.

Energy: Duh, we need off fossil fuels. The NGD is hardly perfect, but the only thing going on. At least it's pointing in the right direction.

The judiciary is pretty huge going into the next presidential cycle. So, we can only look at votes by those candidates that are or have been congresspeople. There are various sites for looking at voting records. I'm sure you can find one.


Edited, Mar 19th 2019 10:58am by Elinda
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#21 Mar 19 2019 at 1:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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Gabbard, Warren, and Sanders are the only possible choices here-now that would upset the military-industrial-banking-1%-complex

There's no one you can vote for as president that will seriously impede the military industrial complex. Voting for presidents isn't how that's done. You're shoehorning these murdered kids where they really don't belong.

Keep those kids where they belong, in poor, strategically important countries.
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#22 Mar 20 2019 at 4:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Anyone watching American Gods? Season 2 started last night - it's pretty good for literature turned tv. The Laura - Mad Sweeney relationship is way different - and better, than what my imagination had lent to it when it originally read the book (although it's been a few years). Gaiman should make a cameo appearance.


It's been a couple of years since I read the book, so I may be misremembering, but I'm fairly certain Sweeney and Laura never met. Also, so far season 2 doesn't seem to have much in common with the book at all, beyond the meet up at the House on the Rock. Which is a bit odd. The first season was actually very faithful to the book, beyond that one episode in the gun obsessed town.

No, as to this whole presidential nonsense. It's just way too early for me to care. I'll start to pay attention around the middle of next year.
#23 Mar 20 2019 at 7:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Elinda wrote:
The rumblings I'm getting from many of the pundits that I allow access into my brain are implying that the only two with a chance to win president in 2020 are Biden and Bernie. While a Bernie-Biden battle going into the primary finals would be a fun battle to watch, I don't think either are the person we need sitting in the white house. I need to find some new voices....


if that's what the pundits are saying, then the Dems have a really tough road ahead. I don't think either of those two are electable in the long run. And that's before even getting into the whole "I thought the Republicans were the party of old white men" angle.

I think that the real problem for the Dems is that they have hitched their wagon to identity/victim politics for so long that it's almost all they have left in terms of platform and agenda. As a result, they are increasingly pressured from the very identity/victim groups they've been courting for so long into accepting, if not adopting, policy positions that are vehemently opposed by those who aren't nutjob crazies. For every young foolish idealist they snatch up via this process, they lose like 1.5 reasonable rational voters. The rise of folks like AOC in the party is pushing out the very voting block that cost them the election last time around: working and middle class blue collar workers.

The Dems need to figure out how to appeal to that group, not double down on the insanity. It's going to be incredibly hard for any candidate to thread that needle and manage to appeal to the young idealists while not pushing away the folks who care about things like their paychecks, mortgage costs, health care costs, providing for their children, having jobs still available in 10 years, heck even having a "plan" they can look to that goes more than 6 months into the future. Once you get out of your turmoil ridden teen and young adult years, you really do want things to stabilize a bit. You want to know what things are going to be like down the road so you can plan your life. What the far left is arguing for would introduce yet more chaos that a lot of voters just aren't going to want.

And those are the voters the Dems need. I suppose if they could find someone who fit the identity checkboxes but wasn't defined by them, they might be able to pull it off. But the problem is that if you are a Dem and a member of any of those identity groups, you kinda have to be defined by that. You can't be a female Democrat without being fully behind every feminist group. You can't be a black Democrat without being fully behind every single black based organization, no matter how out there. Ditto for all other groups. And as some of those groups get more loud and more fringe, they (the politicians, not the groups) find themselves unable to ever say "no" to them. Again, no matter how nutty the positions and proposals are.

The Democrats need to be able to tell the voters where they stand, not just what they stand for. It's easy to say you're for a cleaner environment. But clearly stating where in the spectrum of possible positions on the issue you are is harder. Identifying where the balance between cost to implement and value of the action proposed is difficult. But, IMO, it's necessary. And the Dems just have a hard time doing it. Even the folks getting cornered on the whole NGD thing are having to fall back to half statements, and vagueness to try to wiggle out. It's clear they don't agree with the whole set of proposals, but they can't actually say so openly and publicly. And as long as that's the case, the Dems are going to struggle with this.


Doesn't mean they can't succeed. Just that it's going to either require someone with just the right message, or a whole lot of blatant lying and folks looking the other way until the election is over. It could happen though.

Edited, Mar 21st 2019 11:48am by gbaji
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#24 Mar 20 2019 at 11:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think both side should get back to helping Americans in need and rebuilding our crap-tastic infrastructure, but I crazy like that.
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#25 Mar 21 2019 at 11:23 AM Rating: Good
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Friar Bijou wrote:
I think both side should get back to helping Americans in need and rebuilding our crap-tastic infrastructure, but I crazy like that.
I'm definitely with you on the latter. I'm partially with you on the former.
#26 Mar 21 2019 at 1:02 PM Rating: Good
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You only wish to partially help Americans in need? Is it that you are wary of the definitions of "need" being used, or do you just hate some Americans? Smiley: lol
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